Where could I find (or how could I make) simplified male/female figures?

  • @bagginsbill Yes, of course. I thought since you had said you were doing something "a bit more complicated," I'd try to get the basics down first. For example, I came across a link to your The-Fresnel-Effect-Glass-Paint-Plastic-and-Metal tutorial in the runtimedna.com forum that's gone now. The first few posts in that thread were archived at the WayBack Machine, so that was intriguing. You mentioned a shader pack of metals you were putting together. Do you sell shader packs?

    (And by the way, I can't for the life of me figure out how to save a shader configuration.)

  • Poser Ambassadors

    The shader I showed included the ghosting effect since I anticipated you'd want that instead of just plain glass.

    If you only want plain glass then start with the first one and just wire the FresnelBlend Inner_Color to the Refract node, skipping the Blender with Diffuse. Then it's just a simple, clear glass.

  • Cool, thanks!

    Gotta say, my brain is kind of exploding with all the options... Just getting into this, really don't know what I'm doing...

  • Poser Ambassadors

    Well I just watched many tutorials and not one shows how to save a material. Nor does the Poser manual. It shows saving other things but not a material.


    While you're in the material room with the library open, click the icon for materials.
    Select a folder in the folder tree.
    If you want a new folder first, click the bottom first icon to make a New Folder.
    Then with the right folder highlighted, click the bottom + icon to save the material. You get prompted for a name and some options.

    If you're using a name that already exists, you have to do an extra confirmation step.

  • Yes! Beautiful, thanks!!

  • OK, I've been poking around a little bit, and getting somewhere thanks to your help, @bagginsbill. One thing I will need to do is to have light-emitting objects inside of a body, and to have that show through the transparency of the figure's surface. I've just taken a shot at a simple approach of placing a point light inside my character's chest. Below is what I got. The light shows when it scatters off the front-facing surface areas of the figure and the box behind, (see particularly the inside of the arms), but does not show any emission through the chest at all. I'm guessing this might have to do with turning off "Visible in Raytracing." Am I right?

    alt text

    Whatever the cause, is it possible for me to create a figure with an illumination located inside the figure, glowing outward?

  • Poser Ambassadors

    Yes this is called translucence. It is when the "back" side (or inside) of a surface is lit and diffuses that light through to the front side. The addition of one more node in the right place with the right settings will do it.

    However, it differs between FireFly and SuperFly so I need to know which you intend to use.

    I also need to know if you want the inner light to illuminate just the figure or the entire scene.


  • Poser Ambassadors

    Also I need to ask you to clarify. You said light emitting objects, but you then asked about a light (which is not a light emitting object, but rather a pure source of light with no geometry).

    Do you actually intend to use light emitting objects? If so we just need to set the ambient color and value on those objects and they will be self-lit, but not yet light "emitting". If you want those objects to light other objects we need to either use FireFly with IDL or use SuperFly.

    However with SuperFly the light will behave like real light which may not always be what you want for illustrative purposes. FireFly offers more options but also does less automatically, and certain things it will do less well.

  • Poser Ambassadors

    If you're using FireFly as I am here, you can try this shader. The Clouds part is optional - you can get an even glow by just disconnecting it.


    I'm using colored point lights inside with low intensity (.4% to 1%) and using Inverse Square falloff. The falloff is very important!!!


  • Great questions, @bagginsbill. What I'm doing is building a repertoire. I will want to be able to portray:

    • Pure light sources located inside the body. Sometimes these will need to appear as through they are glowing at a certain size, say half the chest diameter, or more, or even larger than the body, with falloff toward the edges.

    • Objects that "glow" or emit light.

    • Glowing mist or energy or gas.

    • Columns or shafts of light through the body.

    I will gather some 2D examples to illustrate...

  • @bagginsbill That looks very cool! Yes, this will be one effect I'm reaching for.

    So to make sure I'm understanding, the shader you created is applied to Andy, and different color point lights are located inside the head and abdomen?

    Here's one example of what I'm ultimately reaching for: nine different objects, lights, effects with one body:

    alt text

    And here is a very different one:

    alt text

    I will want to be able to show each of these objects isolated, then animate assembling all of these objects together.

    There's an even trickier part that I'll also need to figure out. I'm thinking I should create a new topic for this: animating the morphing of one object into a very different one, for example the lump of distorted flesh in the belly of the second image becoming the vertical column of light in the first image. Not for the faint of heart, I fear...

    What are your thoughts? Am I reaching too far for Poser, or will I be able to figure this out?

  • I realize I just opened up a few cans of worms, probably. Let me be more specific about my first project, to see if it's reasonable that I can do this one in Poser. This involves four different object pairs where the first object transforms into the second within or around the figure.

    The first is straightforward, a metal plate simply moving location from the chest to under the feet:

    alt text

    The second involves a patchy gas/mist in the chest transforming into a cashmere cloak or shawl-type wrap:

    alt text

    The third may be trickier, involving a porcupine-like object on the belly transforming into a glowing light space that occupies inside and outside the front of the chest:

    alt text

    The fourth involves a tiny, glowing heart at the center of the porcupine object that transforms into an infinite, iridescent light radiance all through and around the body:

    alt text

    Finally, putting them all together, I will want to show the first of each of these pairs as a composite, transforming into the second of each of the pairs, like this:

    alt text

    Am I crazy, or is this doable??

  • Poser Ambassadors

    All doable but you're going to be studying and learning a lot about computer graphics.

    Some of these transformations can simply be done with animated shader parameters and a single standard object like a sphere that simply changes position, size and shape through animated parameters. Others will require the creation of custom prop objects with custom morphs to drastically alter the shapes. Some shape alterations, like spikes, can be done in the shader using displacement.

    I'd slow down and tackle the elements first before going straight to one of your illustrations.

    For example, first step is to decide on a number of frames and the frame rate, establish the time line for, say, 8 seconds of animation at 30 frames per second. Practice placing an object at rest for 2 seconds, then have it move smoothly to another place over 4 seconds, then stay in the new spot for 2 seconds.

    Figure out how you're going to process that animation - What format will you save in? How will you compose this with other imagery in 2D or will you compose everything in Poser itself?

    Then try changing its size as well.

    Then try changing its color.


  • Poser Ambassadors

    Here's an example using the Poser Hi-Res sphere as an animating prop.

    The shader is opaque, magenta, and has displacement spikes at the start.
    It has a completely different appearance at frame 30, where it is a yellow mist.
    In setting up this animation, the prop also changes size.

    Here are a couple of the in-between points at frame 10 and 20

  • Poser Ambassadors

    Here's the shader at frame 1
    Notice the parameters that have a lit key - those are animated parameters that take on different values over time.
    Here is the shader at frame 30.

  • Thank you, thank you, thank you, @bagginsbill. Yes, I can see this will take time and learning a lot. You've given me a great start, so I have some idea of what's possible and can plan and test the overall arc of production, like you suggested. Let me see what I can do with it over the coming days/weeks, (along with other portions of the video series I'm creating).

    Just want to say, I really appreciate your help. Your responses to my questions have kept me moving forward with the project where I might have stalled or gone off on some other tangent otherwise. Now I'm hopeful this is actually something I can complete.

  • Poser Ambassadors

    You're welcome. Many of the effects will likely take hours of preparation and testing. But I can just do a crappy proof of concept for them to get you started in each case. Most of the materials you want to make are not obligated to match physical realities and so can be assembled with acknowledgement that whatever comes out from just a few shader nodes is probably sufficient.

  • OK, I'm trying to start simple, wanting to do the left image on this one:

    alt text

    It's like a splotchy cloud/smoke, mostly translucent, that is partly inside the body and partly in front. I've searched all through this forum for posts referencing clouds, smoke and such, and don't have a clear idea yet how to do this. I tried a complex one by @seachnasaigh but he was working in SuperFly and it didn't seem to work at all in FireFly. Do you have any suggestions?

    I'll have to keep in mind that this will need to transform into a thick, cashmere poncho-looking thing, but one thing at a time.

    BTW, I'm trying out the shader you offered above that you described as "almost like a cartoon outline" and will probably tweak it a little further, but it's nicely out of the way of things that will be inside and through:

    alt text

    Using Pauline with some heaviness added, and the Alternate Construct environment with the ground and background set to light gray. It seems this construct might have too darn many lights, and I'd like to get rid of the line at the horizon, but it's a decent starting place, good enough for now.

  • Poser Ambassadors

    @joeshirley said in Where could I find (or how could I make) simplified male/female figures?:

    ...I tried a complex one by @seachnasaigh but he was working in SuperFly and it didn't seem to work at all in FireFly.

    What version of Poser are you using? (P9?, Poser Pro 2014?, P11?)
    Do you want to render in Firefly or Superfly, or is either OK?

    @joeshirley said in Where could I find (or how could I make) simplified male/female figures?:

    Using Pauline with some heaviness added, and the Alternate Construct environment with the ground and background set to light gray. It seems this construct might have too darn many lights, and I'd like to get rid of the line at the horizon, but it's a decent starting place, good enough for now.

    It's easy enough to hide the horizon of the construct, that won't be a problem.

  • @seachnasaigh I'm using Poser 11. @bagginsbill suggested rendering in Firefly, in Where could I find (or how could I make) simplified male/female figures?:

    I suggest you use FireFly here as extreme realism is not important for illustrations like this and FireFly is faster and actually more capable of special effects than SuperFly.