Hairy business: dynamics



  • @morkonan And then, Pinky, we Try To TAKE OVER THE WORLD!



  • @eclark1849 said in Hairy business: dynamics:

    @morkonan And then, Pinky, we Try To TAKE OVER THE WORLD!

    The same thing every night... :)

    Though, I am convinced that in order to do "stuff" that I want Poser to do for me, I have to wrestle a mighty Python beast. I'm not going to get any help doing stuff from Poser/SM. Little convenience things aren't desirable enough to get built into Poser. You know, things like "anything that involves the user doing anything really, really, cool." Cool stuffs, I want to do thems...

    and take over the world. ;)



  • @morkonan
    Look at it on the bright side... if you defeat or tame the Python, we'll call you Apollo.

    So what are the cool things you are trying to do with Poser?
    Have you tried using a different tool for the job in combination with Poser?



  • @krios said in Hairy business: dynamics:

    @morkonan
    Look at it on the bright side... if you defeat or tame the Python, we'll call you Apollo.

    So what are the cool things you are trying to do with Poser?
    Have you tried using a different tool for the job in combination with Poser?

    Yeah, I'm working with some other apps atm. Just bought the Substance indie pack, working with learning Blender a bit (I... can't stand Blender, but I can't fail to acknowledge its power... for free.) and I'm going to start on the Unreal Engine soon.

    What "cool stuff" do I want to do? The biggest thing I've wanted to do for YEARS is to solve the "hair" problem. Almost universally, "almost", there isn't any hair available for Poser that can match the realism of what a good Poser figure is capable of.

    That's like having a race-car, but not having anything but crappy re-tread tires for it. It's friggin' redicrurous... EVERYTHING in Poser has been pushed forward and improved... except for anything having to do with anything about "hair." Want "decent" hair? Grats you, here's some transmapped strip hair that has a decent transmap, but don't worry, you'll have to redo all the textures since they suck...

    Grrrrrr... Yeah, this gets me angry. :) You can tweak render settings until your fingers bleed and your processors beg you to stop, but no matter how darn awesome your render is, the hair will suck. Suck... Imagine spending hours fine-tuning, getting your render set up, letting it run for a bajillion years, everything looks wonderful... the hair looks like a car ran over a stray cat while it was humping a slightly surprised, but dead, raccoon.

    So, yeah, that's what sort of "cool" stuff I want to do - FIX POSER HAIR! :)

    /rant off ;)



  • @krios Just wondering, you were using or trying to use Poser's Cloth room on that hair model you were showing right? What if, instead, you used the Bullet Physics controls on the hair? You should even be able to style it a bit if you constrain the hair by varying amounts.



  • @morkonan
    A good solution for the hair would be nice. At some point I tried making a hair model for dynamic cloth simulation, but it just ended up looking like a rag on the character's head.

    @eclark1849
    The bullet physics might hold some possibilities, but it requires a lot of experimenting for now. Don't even know how to include body parts into the sim... it only recognizes objects

    0_1510249166924_hairy-business_3.jpg



  • Hair has its own physical qualities. It has "memory" and, in aggregate, it has volume and collision effects in the interior. High quality, lifelike, movement effects for hair are very intensive calculations. I don't think Poser will ever be robust enough, nor its customer base have the resources, to render "Planet of the Apes" (reboot version) quality hair movement in animations.

    What I want is at least realistic looking hair for still shots. I'm not too concerned about animation and movement effects other than a primary drape/generation. Currently, what's available is transmapped hair, which is generally of widely varying quality and even good models have baked in highlights/bad materials, or Poser's dynamic hair, which was fine for its day, but it has never, ever, yielded desirable results. (Proof = Nobody uses it, nobody makes products for it, it's only ever rendered as an example of what the Hair Room cough up)

    There have been some great "materials" threads here. But, what's needed is a combined approach, something that at least approaches a level of success across all features of "hair" that yields a reasonably consistent result in terms of quality of "realism."

    All too often, it's a case of "on thing or another" just... sucking. I'm pretty easy to satisfy and am willing to work on personal solutions if I can just get something that is workable in terms of realism. Dynamic hair hits a brick wall with ease-of-use and substandard material effects while transmapped strip hair is entirely hit-or-miss in terms of realism. Actually, most transmapped strip hair models are physically impossible shapes and styles for realistic hair to achieve without the use of plaster and heavy construction materials.

    I guess the reference images for most hair models were pictures of what happens when someone styles their hair with "Gorilla Glue." It's also why most hair models look like "helmets" instead of "hair." Then again, all 3D characters could still be living in the ''80's...

    alt text



  • @morkonan
    And that's why the glorious updo hair has been invented:

    0_1510267808513_updus.jpg

    Imagine some of these with traditional "helmet" hair and some runaway segments as bullet physics:

    0_1510267891192_ref.jpg

    BTW, can anyone recommend some good updo hair models?



  • Hair as a cloth would be excellent, it's the reason why all Poser women have short hair. Of course, skin in Poser should also be a cloth, since between joints the skinis just, well, wrong. Of course, the muscles should span joints, which is why Poser has short-hared woman and men, with no muscle tone (you can see the flaws with both hair and skin that way...)



  • @morkonan said in Hairy business: dynamics:

    the hair looks like a car ran over a stray cat while it was humping a slightly surprised, but dead, raccoon.

    ROFL!!!


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