Poser 11 crashes when you GOZ props to Zbrush.



  • @trepleen

    Have you tried exporting each of the child props with GoZ as posed and appending them together in ZBrush?



  • I'm not sure that this is a bug, as much as it is a workflow issue. You're dealing with separate objects here, and if you export children with the parent prop you're effectively trying to combine several objects together, and the bridge doesn't know what to do, or how to combine separate objects into one. No can do.

    Take the terrain with child props for example. When you export the terrain to ZBrush, and you are prompted to select the item to send to ZBrush, uncheck EVERYTHING but the terrain. Make sure you check the option to export it as POSED. That will export the terrain alone, in the "correct" place.

    Now, go back to Poser. Next you want to export one of the child props. Uncheck everything but the child prop you want to export. GoZ that to ZBrush. Export that prop as Posed also. Then "append" the child prop to the terrain in ZBrush and it should show up in the right place. The Terrain and the prop will be separate "tools" in ZBrush that you can morph independently from each other. But because they are appended into one tool, you can see how they relate to each other.

    Continue on in this manner until you export everything you need to morph to ZBrush. Morph one object at a time, and then GoZ them back to Poser. Poser should keep track of which object you are exporting back, and apply the morph to the correct prop.

    As far as your initial example, it's the same type of situation. First export your figure using Figure > Export Figure Mesh to GoZ. When you choose the figure to export, UNCHECK the prop that is attached, because it is a separate object. Export the figure as POSED.

    Now to back to Poser again, and choose Object > Export Object Mesh to GoZ. Uncheck everything except the prop you want to morph. Export THAT as posed also.

    In ZBrush, append the figure to the prop. You will be able to morph each independantly. Then select the item you want to send back to Poser ... when you export the figure, it will ask if you want to apply it as a full body morph to the character. When you export the prop, it will ask if you want to apply it as a morph to the prop.



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  • Banned

    @shvrdavid said in Poser 11 crashes when you GOZ props to Zbrush.:

    From what you just said, the props that shift don't load where they end up once un-parented.

    Adding a fix for props that do that may not be the best option, but we will see.

    Wait wait. When a prop shifts world position after unparenting that is most likely a result of a script needed for the props functionality. That is intended behavior. There's no need to fix that or mess with that. My point is that having to unparent a prop before GOZing to avoid Poser 11 crashing shouldn't be something I have to do.

    What needs to be fixed is when you export a prop that is attached to something or has attachments Poser will crash. Some props cause the crash and some don't. This doesn't happen with all props. I would say about 50% of props that are attached or have attachments will cause Poser to crash when you GOZ the object.

    One easy fix solution could be to have an option I check like this: "Export prop and ignore parent/child attachments". That way the prop can stay attached or keep it's attachment(s) but be GOZ'ed to Zbrush as if it has no attachments or isn't parented to anything. This could be the quickest and most effective way to solve the problem with minimum coding.



    @Deecey said in Poser 11 crashes when you GOZ props to Zbrush.:

    I'm not sure that this is a bug, as much as it is a workflow issue.

    Poser 11 shouldn't crash though.

    You're dealing with separate objects here, and if you export children with the parent prop you're effectively trying to combine several objects together, and the bridge doesn't know what to do, or how to combine separate objects into one. No can do.

    I'm not doing an export via File-->Export-->OBJ ... I'm using GOZ feature. The GOZ feature may in some cases export the attached props by default. There is no way to de-select attached props in the GOZ menu that appears in Poser. I have to un-parent the attached props which sometimes causes certain props to shift world position.

    Take the terrain with child props for example. When you export the terrain to ZBrush, and you are prompted to select the item to send to ZBrush......

    I'm not prompted to select what I want to GOZ to Zbrush. When I click Export Object Mesh To GOZ there is no option to choose what you want to GOZ. That would be a great idea and would most likely solve the issue. We should be able to exclude parented props when clicking GOZ via a checklist. That would solve the problem.

    Now, go back to Poser. Next you want to export one of the child props. Uncheck everything but the child prop you want to export. GoZ that to ZBrush. Export that prop as Posed also. Then "append" the child prop to the terrain in ZBrush and it should show up in the right place. The Terrain and the prop will be separate "tools" in ZBrush that you can morph independently from each other. But because they are appended into one tool, you can see how they relate to each other.

    What do you mean uncheck everything? That is not a feature of GOZ. I wish it was. Are you talking about exporting an OBJ manually? Exporting OBJ's and re-importing OBJ's for morph targets does not work. The scales are always off and it results in broken geometry.

    If you can figure out how to export an OBJ, modify it in 3d studio max or Zbrush, export it properly for use as a morph target, I would love to know how you got it to work. This has been broken since Poser's inception.

    Continue on in this manner until you export everything you need to morph to ZBrush. Morph one object at a time, and then GoZ them back to Poser. Poser should keep track of which object you are exporting back, and apply the morph to the correct prop.

    I wish this worked, but it doesn't. Like I said above, creating morph targets via OBJ has been broken since Poser first came out. I challenge anyone to write a guide on how to get this workflow working with 3D studio Max or Zbrush without the use of GOZ.

    As far as your initial example, it's the same type of situation. First export your figure using Figure > Export Figure Mesh to GoZ. When you choose the figure to export, UNCHECK the prop that is attached, because it is a separate object. Export the figure as POSED.

    I don't get the option to uncheck the prop that is attached. I really wish this feature was actually in Poser. I have to unparent the prop manually which in some cases causes the prop to change world position.

    The GOZ export option menu does not give you the option to uncheck attached props, that would be a GREAT feature though! Maybe I've missed something. Can you show me where this option is on the GOZ menu? I have Poser 11.

    Now to back to Poser again, and choose Object > Export Object Mesh to GoZ. Uncheck everything except the prop you want to morph. Export THAT as posed also.

    I wish this was an actual feature in Poser, but it's not unfortunately. Unless I'm missing something? When you click Figure ->> Export figure to GOZ, there is no way to uncheck attached props from the little menu that appears, or is there?



  • @trepleen

    " I don't get the option to uncheck the prop that is attached. I really wish this feature was actually in Poser. I have to unparent the prop manually which in some cases causes the prop to change world position.."

    Duh you're right. I was getting myself confused and thinking of OBJ export. I'm very sorry for that misstep. (I was multitasking at the time, working on something else while trying to respond)

    That being said, I've since tried several different sets that have props parented to props, and also tried props parented to figures. I haven't been able to reproduce the crash. It roundtrips fine. I've talked to some other folks. One said he can't reproduce it either, and another said the same as you, it only happens with parented props. I've tried it both ways and with several different types of content, and so far no crash.

    Sorry I couldn't be of more help, and I apologize for the confusion about my steps.



  • @Deecey

    OK let's try this again.

    1. Create a new scene in Poser. Leave Andy there.
    2. Go to the Misc Props folder in the P11 props library and add the Bag of Chips
    3. Reposition the chips so that they are in Andy's left hand. Doesn't have to be perfect, just move it so it's close enough. This is just a simple test, not an artistic one. LOL
    4. Object > Change Parent, set the parent for the chips to Andy's left hand.
    5. Now raise Andy's left arm. Again we aren't talking about a masterpiece. Just enough to test.

    To Go Z

    1. Select Andy. Figure > Export Figure Mesh to GoZ. Export Posed.
    2. Return to Poser from ZBrush after Andy is added.
    3. Select the chips. Object > Export Object Mesh to GoZ. Export Posed.
    4. In ZBrush, with the Chips selected, expand the Subtool palette and append Andy so they are both in the same tool.

    Does that simple test cause Poser to crash for you?

    0_1519166256959_Andy and chips.png

    If you can recommend some other content from the P11 library that causes you to crash I will be glad to test it. I'm not too keen on obtaining the prop you are working with (LOL) and the townhouse scene is a bit to pricey for a test.


  • Banned

    @Deecey said in Poser 11 crashes when you GOZ props to Zbrush.:

    @Deecey

    OK let's try this again.

    1. Create a new scene in Poser. Leave Andy there.
    2. Go to the Misc Props folder in the P11 props library and add the Bag of Chips
    3. Reposition the chips so that they are in Andy's left hand. Doesn't have to be perfect, just move it so it's close enough. This is just a simple test, not an artistic one. LOL
    4. Object > Change Parent, set the parent for the chips to Andy's left hand.
    5. Now raise Andy's left arm. Again we aren't talking about a masterpiece. Just enough to test.

    To Go Z

    1. Select Andy. Figure > Export Figure Mesh to GoZ. Export Posed.
    2. Return to Poser from ZBrush after Andy is added.
    3. Select the chips. Object > Export Object Mesh to GoZ. Export Posed.
    4. In ZBrush, with the Chips selected, expand the Subtool palette and append Andy so they are both in the same tool.

    Does that simple test cause Poser to crash for you?

    If you can recommend some other content from the P11 library that causes you to crash I will be glad to test it. I'm not too keen on obtaining the prop you are working with (LOL) and the townhouse scene is a bit to pricey for a test.

    This is from my original post:

    Now let's say you attach a box primitive to Andy and GOZ the box, it won't crash. You have to actually have a scene that people ACTUALLY use in commercial renders.

    I'm going to make a list of all commercial content from DAZ & Renderosity that cause the crash.

    1. Lali's bits. GOZing V4 to Zbrush with Lali's Bits attached causes a crash. Unparenting lali's bits prevents the crash from occuring but the prop shifts world position.
    2. Modern Home 1 - https://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/modern-home-1-poser-amp-ds-/102255 - The Terrain prop causes a crash.

    There's more, i just have to add it to the list as I work with various assets.

    Sorry I couldn't be of more help, and I apologize for the confusion about my steps.

    You actually came up with a good idea. There should be an option for us to check what we want to GOZ to Zbrush. There should be a checklist. Your brainstorming led to a good solution. Imagine being able to select precisely what you want to GOZ to Zbrush and have it auto-append. Being able to de-select a prop from being automatically exported to Zbrush via GOZ would solve the crashing problem.



  • @trepleen

    I appreciate the content references, but I won't be purchasing or testing any "adult related" add-ons. Not my thing.



  • @trepleen said in Poser 11 crashes when you GOZ props to Zbrush.:

    There should be an option for us to check what we want to GOZ to Zbrush.

    Actually you already do when you select the figure or prop to GoZ. So I'm not sure if there is any other thing going on, especially when I haven't been able to reproduce a crash yet.



  • OK I was able to obtain the Modern Home set. Once again, I cannot reproduce a crash when I try to export the Terrain to and from ZBrush with GoZ.

    But there seems to be something odd about the terrain prop. Here's what I did. I exported the Terrain 1 prop with GoZ, and set it to "Posed" so that hopefully it would export in the correct position and scale.

    Once into ZBrush I had to subdivide the mesh to create a morph (the resolution of the base prop is too low to work with otherwise). After I displaced some of the polygons, I dialed the resolution back to the base level before GoZ'ing back to Poser.

    Here's the puzzling part. Theoretically, all that should have changed is that the prop would just displace the vertices that I moved. But the entire scale of the terrain changed as well.

    So next, I tried to export the terrain to ZBrush without checking the "Export as Posed" option. Same thing happened.

    There's something funky going on here with the content and I'm trying to assess what the problem is. Even though I'm not getting the crash like you do, doesn't work as expected with GoZ. The only thing I can think of is it might be because all of the geometries for each prop are embedded into the single "Modern Home 1" Prop file, instead of being referenced as external objects. But that might take some more digging.


  • Poser Ambassadors

    @Deecey - the subdivision algorithm that Zbrush uses is different to Poser (which uses OpenSubDiv). I don't know if this will cause a problem but it has the potential; I'd suggest subdividing in Poser then passing that mesh via GoZ to Zbrush. Another thought, does the geometry pass Zbrush's Mesh Integrity test?



  • @caisson

    Yeah I thought of that. Unfortunately, subdividing the props in Poser causes all of the rectangles in the prop to turn to ovals. So if I subd before sending to GoZ, those "ovals" will be baked in on return.

    Denise



  • More followup on the SubD thing. The readme says this product was released in 2013. When in 2013 is the question ... Poser 10 (first version to have subdiv) was released May 2013, so it may be that this model was not even built to be subdivided at all.

    If that's the case, the terrain isn't really built to be morphed. If the purpose of morphing some hills on the terrain is what is desired, there isn't enough geometry in the terrain to make that happen.


  • Poser Ambassadors

    @Deecey - sounds like you're right - rectangles turning to ovals doesn't sound good. Could you post a screenshot of the wires before & after subD?



  • @caisson
    I apologize for the size of this image, but this is full size preview, no subdiv and subdiv of 4

    0_1519252959387_terrain.png



  • And wireframe view

    0_1519253090540_wireframe.png

    As you can see, not enough there to morph without subdivision.



  • Finally in ZBrush, including the area in the back that I tried to morph ...

    0_1519253463204_zbrush.png


  • Poser Ambassadors

    @Deecey - thanks - the ZB screen is the most interesting - looks like several pieces of closely intersecting geo, I can't tell if it's all joined or not. If it is all a single piece of mesh then ouch. Definitely not built for subD ;)

    At the base of the Geometry palette in Zbrush there is a button labelled Check Mesh Integrity, if you haven't already tried running that it may be worth it to see if it reports any problems.



  • @caisson

    First, the mesh integrity function in ZB reported 5 edges that are shared by more than 2 polygons. So there was that.

    As far as whether or not it is one contiguous mesh, I exported it from Poser and opened it up in Modo. It's not all contiguous, there are 5 separate pieces. Here's a cap from Modo with the individual pieces colored differently

    0_1519260870676_colored.png



  • And sub divided in Modo to level of 2

    0_1519260961061_modosubd.png