DAZ dForce vs Poser Cloth Simulation



  • @fbs7 O-okay! I think I see what you're getting at, but here's the problem with your scenario. D-force isn't a Cloth simulation, it's a physics engine. So no, the Cloth simulation in Poser couldn't do that, but the Bullet Physics engine could. As for making it work more intuitively, recall that the Bullet Physics engine in Poser is a third party application, pretty much like the Cloth Sim engine. As far as I know, SM hasn't actually programmed anything in the engine for the way it works in Poser. I won't lie to you, I've watched the videos on how it works and it looks relatively easy enough, but despite what I've seen, I'm STILL uneasy with using the BP engine. That said, at least the third party that programs the BP is still around, unlike the Cloth Sim engine, so if you have any concerns with the way it works you could ask SM to talk to them or take your case directly to them for any changes you'd like to see.



  • @amethystpendant said in DAZ dForce vs Poser Cloth Simulation:

    @fbs7 But surely you could easily write a script to do that, admittedly you would need to run two sims spawn the morph targets then merge the 2 together with a script. Not simple I agree, but if you wanted the system to work the way you describe, internally it would have to spawn a copy of the object and run a simulation on each then after it had finished use the deltas from the copy and merge them with the original, or 3 copies if you wanted everything choreographed as well.

    My thoughts exactly! I was bored back in Dec, and I was thinking of writing a script to calculate these deltas for a full body, using a specially named texture as weight map (get uv from vertex, lookup texture, find the weight map from grayscale or something). It would need to have no collisions, though, as collisions are horribly CPU-intensive and can't do that in Python... but could have some simple spring-based dynamic effects thing.

    Once one has the deltas calculated in memory, it's actually pretty simple to hook that in the display event and incorporate the deltas in the geometry for display purpose only. There's a demo from SM on that.

    But in the end I thought that was more than I could chew, and didn't try it. Also the need to prepare such texture for each cloth seemed to be a big pain.


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    As far as I understood is that props or objs don't work without additional effort in dforce as it still requires some rigging of the sort.

    In Poser's Clothroom and VWD, you can just get an obj simmed.



  • @fbs7 But if you can't do collisions then it isn't really a cloth sim, as the whole purpose, other than draping curtains is the collisions with the wearer and other objects.



  • @amethystpendant said in DAZ dForce vs Poser Cloth Simulation:

    @fbs7 But if you can't do collisions then it isn't really a cloth sim, as the whole purpose, other than draping curtains is the collisions with the wearer and other objects.

    I was thinking of just giving a shuffling or shimmering effect to what would otherwise be a conforming cloth. But that would work for small movements only.



  • @fbs7 has anyone determined the file format for the cloth dynamics files? If so, it might be possible to use a weight map and python script to generate a second dynamics file with modulated dynamics. Perhaps. Depending on whether the file distinguishes dynamics from choreographed vertices.



  • @anomalaus The file format is object files, same as always for both the Poser Cloth Room and the BP engine. Weightmaps would be of little to no use in either the Cloth Room or BP.



  • @eclark1849 no, no. I don't mean the .obj wavefront object geometry definitions, I mean the .dyn dynamic cloth simulation files, which must contain per-frame-per-vertex deformations for the dynamic cloth object for the whole simulation. The .dyn files are a binary format, like (but not the same format as) .pmd, not human-readable text, like .obj files (or even the gzip compressed .obz files).



  • @anomalaus From P11 onwards the extension is now .abc and they are I believe alembic files



  • @anomalaus
    I have understood these files use the in Alembic format.
    (@amethystpendant did beat me by a minute on this one, LOL!)



  • @amethystpendant & @fverbaas thanks, it's been that long since I ran simulations regularly, and since I'm now using autosave, the simulations get hidden away in subdirectories. I am seeing .abc Alembic files for the most recent cloth simulation.



  • I wouldn't touch the cloth simulation files with a 50-feet spear... the thing already breaks a lot on its own without external help...



  • @fbs7
    It seems VWD uses these files to communicate with Poser.



  • @fverbaas said in DAZ dForce vs Poser Cloth Simulation:

    @fbs7
    It seems VWD uses these files to communicate with Poser.

    Haven't played with VWD since it was launched, really must! But yes the proc calculates the sim and writes the results to the alembic file so that Poser can apply them