Vendor Tales...

  • Generally speaking we're derailing a lot of threads talking about what vendors can do to increase sales, or why people aren't buying as much content any more, So this is a catchall thread where you don't have to sorry about derailing other threads. Got ideas for sales, Poser suggestions, marketing ideas, etc. Post them here.

  • @eclark1849 Actually, I would like to know, as vendors and content creators, what would you need or like for SM/Poser to do to make content creation easier?

  • @eclark1849 Content creation isn't "hard," but it is time consuming and tedious. A content creator has to be someone who is very focused on details and willing to invest the time to get every minor detail perfect.

    What SM and everyone else has to do is to make content creation worth the effort.

    Short of that, it doesn't matter.

  • @Glitterati3D That sounds more like something every vendor needs to find out for him or herself.

  • @eclark1849 That's probably true, but the one thing that answers the question is customers. SM doesn't have enough to make content creation worth the effort.

  • @Glitterati3D I don't know if I would go that far. Content is more than just clothing for one specific figure.

  • Poser Ambassadors

    I think it has various reason why people stop buying content. Less money, market flooded and over saturated.
    Sales where people can buy for cheap high quality content at half of the price, so they wait .
    Many make now own content. With free Blender possible for everybody who is interested on it.
    Many move to DS because Genesis, disappointment about Poser's last release .

  • @Ladonna I agree with you. A lot of people are leaving for Studio. I honestly believe though that it has more to do with hype and marketing than Genesis.

  • Poser Ambassadors

    @eclark1849 When Poser vendors move to DS , people follow. There is less and less content for Poser. People go where the content is. Simple as that.
    But here I say, Poser users dig here there own grave. Instead of supporting Poser vendors, you hear them whining about Genesis. Still, after years. Every Poser figure which get released get trashed and torn apart in public.Very discouraging for every vendors who put work and effort in his creation.

  • @eclark1849 It doesn't matter how many figures we're discussing.

    How many times/ways do you have to read that the few Poser customers left will not pay over $5.00 for a product, and better if it's free?

    There's no ROI for a vendor on Poser products anymore.

  • Poser Ambassadors

    @Glitterati3D True. I don't know when Poser users become like this, but many want a product high quality, X-texture variation, versatile, but pay not more than 5-10 $. For this nobody create anymore.
    They don't get that the vendors have costs, sometimes very high costs, than Market place want 50%, after all they have to pay also tax. Here in France ridiculous high. At last, you go home with a handful € for weeks of work.

  • Boy, I must be the one in a million Poser customer who's willing to pay more for a product as long as it's worth it. Sure, I have items in my Wishlists at stores I regularly shop in, but not because I'm necessarily waiting for a sale, or a Renderosity coupon, but because I like it, but don't necessarily need it right away.

    It's a sad fact a lot of customers, both Poser and DS, wait for sales so they don't have to pay full price, but as has been said before, not everyone can afford paying full price. A good number of customers in the 3D community, myself included, are senior citizens and on limited budgets, so lumping them all together into a group that's too cheap to pay full price, is very harsh if you ask me.

    The 3D Community is huuuuuge, and there is no real way for anyone to account for what the majority, or even half, of those folks do when they're shopping in the 3D marketplaces, so I'm not going to assume they're all looking to purchase "on the cheap" simply because they don't want to, or can't afford to, spend the money.

  • Poser Ambassadors

    @Miss-B The problem is not that they wait for sales. Sales we had in the past too. But even with huge sales the Poser user did not buy and when they buy than when it is in clearance. They want extra textures, extra morphs, camera settings for the environments and light settings. In Poser firefly and for Superfly. But don't want to pay more than $ 10. This can not work.
    My free outfit for PE. To sort out the textures and shaders for both render engines cost me 2 weeks extra. Modeling, rigging , create the textures, thumbnails, readme and tutorial,testing . What would be here an proper price?16-20 $? No one Poser user would pay this. This is fact.

  • @eclark1849

    I can think of a number of things.

    1. Fix the OBJ export so that it exports an OBJ file that has the same vertex count and same winding order as the original OBJ you used to create the content in the first place. This would probably require saving the OBJ information somewhere before it is split apart during CR2 creation.

    2. Poser really needs to work with "real world" scale. The extremely small scale Poser uses results in rounding errors that cause OBJ's to go out of symmetry, due to translation and rotation shifts. After creating a CR2, the figure's right side (your left) shifts and rotates slightly, making it extremely difficult to get symmetry back for parts that don't have a center axis (like eyes, lashes, fingernails, toenails, and teeth). This happens when an OBJ file is used to create a CR2. To prove this, import a grouped OBJ file into Poser. Immediately export it again (as a prop) and check the symmetry. Seems to be OK. But now, convert that prop to a figure in the usual manner. Export that OBJ. No longer symmetrical.

    3. Provide figures WITH POSER that will entice people to create content for them. This means, figures that look decent, morph decent, and pose decent right out of the box. With third party figures, it's hard to know how many people have that figure and content creators may end up with only a small number of sales of their supporting content. On the other hand, if the figures are provided with Poser, the content creators know that everyone who upgraded to that version of Poser has the figures. If the figures that come with Poser are top grade out of the box, they will probably be supported better.

    I could go on. But these are my top three.

  • You aren’t the only one.

    I have commissioned clothing, I have dropped $150 a month on average since Dec 2004 (I am close to the $25,000 marker.)

    What I buy has changed. Vendors don’t want to make content for non-Daz figures, so I am buying props, sets, and merchant resources. I would prefer to buy content for non-Daz figures, but I can’t make a vendor make the content.

    Vendors over the past decade have made it clear that they are only interested in making hookerware and impractical armor - and they have told potential customers that if they don’t want to buy what they are personally interested in making, we should learn to make our own content.

    And here we are. Everyone that isn’t a rank beginner takes their M4V4 content into the fitting room and voila! No need to buy new clothing.

    I buy g figure content to fill spaces that aren’t being addressed. If I need kids, I’m either buying g content or I am using Luke/Laura or the millennium kids. If I need more than a couple non-Caucasians, I am buying g content, because over 95% of all figures sold are early 20’s Caucasians.

    When I do buy content, I also calculate how much time it will take me to make a product Poser 9+ compliant. More work I have to do, the less I am willing to pay.

    Want me to pay Stonemason prices for your product? Make it that well, and make it Poser 9+ compliant, not Poser 6 ready, regardless of the base mesh.

    Let me reiterate - I would prefer to buy clothing content made for non-Daz figures, but when the vendors decline to do so, my money is spent on other things.

  • @Ladonna said in Vendor Tales...:

    Ladonna, I will say this... The most expensive thing I ever bought at DAZ, aside from Poser 7, was Victoria 2 upgrade. As far as I can recall, I never spent more than $12 for any ONE single product. I think one thing, vendors need to keep in mind, is that if you're NOT a vendor, this is mostly a hobby for many of the users. $20 is a luxury. I don't even go to the movies any more, and if I did, $20 would be cheap by comparison.

  • @eclark1849 All fine and dandy, Earl. But, based on that price point are you willing to accept ONE texture, no morphs and a single clothing item? No shoes, no jewelry included, one set of textures and no morphs.

    In order to get an ROI on modeling, texturing and rigging, AND sell for $10.00 that's all you're gonna get.

  • @Glitterati3D said in Vendor Tales...:

    @eclark1849 All fine and dandy, Earl. But, based on that price point are you willing to accept ONE texture, no morphs and a single clothing item? No shoes, no jewelry included, one set of textures and no morphs.

    In order to get an ROI on modeling, texturing and rigging, AND sell for $10.00 that's all you're gonna get.

    Truth? It depends on what bills I have to pay that month. If it's something i really want or need, I might sacrifice. Otherwise it'll have to wait.

  • @eclark1849 So, the vendor's bills take 2nd fiddle to yours.

    Based on $10.00, the vendor will get $6.00 of that $10.00, before any coupons or other gimmicks that reduce the price. Assuming, you purchase anytime other than the initial offering where it's 30% right off the top to begin with.

    Most sales, a vendor is lucky to see $3.00 of a $10.00 item.

  • @Glitterati3D said in Vendor Tales...:

    @eclark1849 So, the vendor's bills take 2nd fiddle to yours.

    Umm, yeah.