Vendor Tales...

  • @Glitterati3D said in Vendor Tales...:

    So, the vendor's bills take 2nd fiddle to yours.

    Well, in my book, that's called survival. When it comes between a choice of buying content, or buying groceries, I'd choose the groceries. ;-)

  • @Deecey As do I which is why I am no longer a vendor. I'm done investing in hundreds of dollars worth of tools to create content no one is willing to pay for.

  • @Glitterati3D

    I hear ya, girl. I hear ya.

    I spent more on fabrics to scan than I've made on the Fabric Frenzy merchant resources. And those are merchant resources!

    Good gawd.

  • @Deecey I know. And it's just soooooooo sad.

    But I bought every single set. Not that it means much, but I did.

    I use them constantly and make sure I credit your great materials when I do.

  • @Glitterati3D said in Vendor Tales...:

    @Deecey As do I which is why I am no longer a vendor. I'm done investing in hundreds of dollars worth of tools to create content no one is willing to pay for.

    Tracy, I'm not out to cheat anybody. As I said, this is a hobby for me. Now, if I were in a business or something and making money off what I buy and use, then yeah, I could afford to pay more. Even Turbosquid money.

  • @Glitterati3D

    Hugs atcha! Thank you 8-D

  • I have made this recommendation before, but I’ll make it again....

    A kickstarter type of setup for content. This way a vendor knows they will see a profit before they start on something.

  • Heh, I have a ways to go, but I'm hoping I can get good enough one day to sell something at Turbosquid. :)

  • Poser Ambassadors

    Yes, the best thing to do to manage the time/price ratio, is to make products with less options.

    That's the clever thing to do...

    ...However when my muse is on a roll..she is on a roll and my wise beta needs to tell me 3 times, STOP ALREADY YOU HAVE ENOUGH OPTIONS before I finish adding options. lol

    You need to make 1 hair not 20 in 1! Leave some ideas for next time!

    How about 5 in 1 then? :P

    Very difficult for me. lol

  • Poser Ambassadors

    @ssgbryan Patreon is ideal for 3D content for that!

  • Poser Ambassadors

    @Biscuits I thought about too Biscuits. I already set up an account and thought to release there my "freebies" where people can contribute from $1 At last a bit motivation to create more freebies :)

  • I agree with a lot of the points above. I hear them every day.

    One point I would like to add though, is that SM and DAZ are not the only marketplaces for Poser compatible product. Yes eclark 1849 has a directory. It is Poser centric and a lot of Poser users have moved beyond it.

    As Miss b says; a lot of us have grown older and have less disposable income to blow on a hobby that does not make us, users; an income. Just an outgo of our limited income on pretty pictures.

    As Vilter said in most every thread. Roll your own. So now a lot of us have. We use free modeling software to make things UVed in a free mapper and texture it in free photopaint software. We didn't know how but the nonexistent cost of entry got us to try. A lot of us have succeeded. We can do simple box modeling and make basic textures. This has liberated our checkbooks to some extent.

    Deecey is correct in regard to scale and the breaking of OBJs. These two things slow down the do it yourself crowd, but the amount of threads regarding this and the ways around it are now well known to most Poser users.

    ssgbryan is correct in pointing out that the vendors themselves have said, and are saying now; that if you don't like what they make go elsewhere or do it yourself. It's too much work to make something that won't sell a few hundred units in the first two weeks before the pirates get it and post their hard work on line for anyone to get for free.

    Ladonna is correct in that the larger markets take a big chunk of the sale and local governments want their fair share of your hard work and income. This leaves little for the person who did all the work and there is no point unless you have a lot of sales of a given item.

    Everyone who vends wants the super duper boss hog of characters that everyone will drool over and beg to buy content for. If that character comes along every vendor will be rich because they can sell new conforming clothing.

    That is the problem. It's not a P6 compatible workflow with P4 textures that people want to spend their hard earned cash on. I hear vendors complain about a figures rigging and/or the person/company that foisted this crap on the market thus ruining their income all the time. I hear vendors cry that the only clothes being made are dynamic because no one can make a JCM laden outfit to conform to whatever figure Poser hobbyists are using at the time. The complaints of refitted clothing appearing each iteration of a figure. That the vendors are just reworking stuff for a new rig.

    Dynamic cloth decouples an item of clothing from a rig. Cuts into vendor sales. So does the Fitting Room. A Poser user that has just purchased the software will happily use the toys provided. The official vids from SM, that a large number of new users would be likely to check out; feature ways to use Poser irregardless as to where you buy your content.

    Poser's import options allow for a huge amount of content, not purchased at DAZ, Rendo, or SM to be easily imported and used. The only thing that vendors have going for them is that they know how to rig. That is not much. Hard surface rigging is quite simple once a user tries it a few times. Organic not so easy.

    Hobbyists have time to fool around and make mistakes. It costs them nothing. Vendors need a return on time and software investment. They can't make one offs or specialty items and make a living from them. They need to sell stuff users cannot easily make or appears too hard to attempt. Stuff that will not make them money.

    Poser hobbyists have become liberated from the old school vendors and their workflow. They have been given the tools in the software to do much of what vendors have had to do in the past. They have been told for so long to just wait for the newest most high tech figure by the vendors and then their content will come back; that they have found new skills and new markets outside the traditional marketplaces the old school vendors are still trying to move their product in.

    Clothing rigs and character skins are all that is left for vendors to earn from. "Content is king." and we have begun to make our own. Make what we cannot, make product that can be used by more than one software with little more than scale changes and maybe you will earn a closed environment living once again. A vendors options are starting to become a little limited and the strict adherence to "the old ways" is not going to help earn a living in a world where game engines and real time rendering are happening with content that comes in large themed releases.

  • Poser Ambassadors

    Oh Excellent idea! A nice low support tier.

    I was thinking what kind of cool tiers would be possible for 3D content.
    For example for products, one can do theme tiers, like the latest new clothing release as a 10 dollar tier.

  • You know, I was hoping we could all put together our collective heads and try to come up with ways, not to save Poser, that's SM's job, but to sell more content. Here's the thing though, because as I said, I have learned to model, so I can make my own stuff where as once I would have had to buy. But if all the creators DO migrate to Studio, and SM pulls Poser from the market. What happens to all the vendors then? Because, I really don't see the people using Poser following to Studio. I know I won't, but then, I do have Blender. But sounds like the inflo of new vendors selling to Studio users would oversaturate the market, and depress the very prices you all just left to get. You'll certainly be up against even more vendors, and as I understand it, they'll have better quality stuff because Poser doesn't rig right. And any Poser users who do follow will be scared off by the even higher prices that you claim they're not willing to pay now. So then what???

  • @eclark1849 Which is why I just gave up the ghost and closed my stores. There's simply no future in Poser products. It's past time to give up the ghost.

    Just ask Tony.

  • Sorry to see you leave. Please mind the door on your way out. Thank you. I still remember your rants enthousiastic comments when I released SASHA.
    Good luck Mate!


  • @karina said in Vendor Tales...:

    Sorry to see you leave. Please mind the door on your way out. Thank you. I still remember your rants enthousiastic comments when I released SASHA.
    Good luck Mate!


    I'm sorry, but I had the same reaction ShareCG did to your initial release - portraying a 3D model as a 16 yr. old hooker.

  • I sure seem to stir stuff up, don't I? I don't mean to. Maybe I should just stop posting everywhere.

  • Well if you'ld ever cared to have a brief look at SASHA (which you admittedly didn't) then you might have noticed that she's just the same V4 shape as DAZ's original figure.
    So no minor here (except if you want to make her that way)

    The name SASHA-16 (as explained to literate people in multiple places) stems from the name "SASHA" and it's production year "2016".
    Think of it like "AK-74", "T-72", etc. (Yes I'm semi Russian!)

    I chose her name scheme (S-16) to avoid confusion with DAZ's "S-2" (Stephanie-2, which by your reading would be a two-year old then...) and all it's future reeiterations.

    To further differentiate I added the "-" dash.
    It really is as simple as that.


  • Poser Ambassadors

    Late into this but here we go;

    25 years ago, there was nothing.
    Poser1 came out, and any vendor that could paint a moustache on the P1 male could make a living.
    The vendor that welded 2 cubes together could make an income because he was the first one to do it..

    Nowadays, any end user that goes to sharecg can spend many years rendering with what is available for free.
    And most "old timers" have accumulated many a GB of bought and free content on their HD's.

    Renderosity (who remembers the good old "Blue" site"?, was full of life.
    Now many sites have joined and they are all seeing traffic losses.
    Some remember getting up in the morning, opening Renderosity way back then, and spend hrs of reading the new treads, because EVERYTHING was NEW. PAGES and PAGES of new treads each and every day.
    Now I get up and wonder if there IS a new tread at all? ? ? ?

    Rendersity free stuff in the early years was also pages and pages of NEW free stuff each and every day. Now you are lucky to find anything new.

    Marketplace? Hell, in the very beginning there was NO marketplace.
    Only when vendors started building and selling because "hey we can make some money here" did marketplaces start.

    2018 : The app landscape changed with DS and I-Clone joining (among others)
    Now 25 years and hundreds of thousands of items later saturation is happening because unlike in real life, digital content does not age and is relatively easy to convert to current standards at end users levels.

    25 Years ago, there was dial-up Internet, (for the few lucky ones that had Internet at all). Questions were few and far between. Answers a rarity.

    25 Years ago, there were no support 3D apps (or extremely expensive)
    Anim8or, Wings, Blender, are free for all, and others dropping in price and all of a sudden EVERYBODY can build their own content.

    2018 and we all have high speed Internet, and tutorials all over the place to get everybody going 'at end user level" with whatever app they choose or feel comfortable with. Hell, you can spend your first 3-5 years just by viewing all 3D YouTube tutorials.

    I forgot the Poser/DS battle. The vendors competing. The sites competing. The competition. The buy outs and the buy ups. That is the modern way of doing business. Try to kill the other so survive.
    The first law of mother nature.