How to create realistic bends n Poser figures.

  • Poser Ambassadors

    @vilters Tony, honestly, I will not make me this work with fixing joints on a figure.
    If I do this and I rig, weightmap an outfit with corrected joints, the outfit will not behave correct on Dusk, Dawn from others with the default joint settings.
    I am honest here, Dusk need not really any improvement .I weight map this outfit right now and it goes surprisingly smooth .
    With limits on , almost a walk in the park.
    I don't think vendors who create outfits should change anything on the joint parameters from the character. Avoid head ache and mass hatemails :)

  • Poser Ambassadors

    As I wrote above. Content creators have to continue to use what is in the figure. (Joint position and weight-bulge map.)

    And the dependencies trick to get better bends can still be used because it only tells other bones how to move when it moves. => You can still control the whole arm through dependencies even when the figure joint setup is not optimal.

  • Poser Ambassadors

    What you see here , the Jacket has till now only at the neck and head weight map. Shoulder and collar till now untouched .
    The distortion is there, but honestly not that much for an object which is mostly untouched with the weight map brush.

  • Poser Ambassadors

    @vilters So if not for cloth creation, what kind of advantage did this method give me else? Smooth bending, okay, but this is not enough for the work.
    Is this also working with JCM's?

  • Poser Ambassadors

    @ladonna PS....don't take this wrong, I am pretty much interested .But I want to know not only the pro's, also the contra :)

  • Poser Ambassadors

    Nice render, good light management and scary clothing. He's up to something. LOL.

    PS; The "better bend dependencies" have NO impact on the existing rigging.
    They only tell other bones how to move in relationship to tis own movements.

  • Poser Ambassadors


    The "pro" is more realistic bends with less work.
    You "only" have to pose the shoulder bone to get the complete arm to move in a realistic way. In the video, I show the "bend" setup but the same is valid for forwards-backwards movement of the arm where the collars also move forwards-backwards.

    In a complete setup, all end users have to do is "pose the shoulder", and all the posing of the rest of the arm movement is done automatically by the dependencies.

    The contra is that you are limited by the existing rigging and you really need good joints/maps to get the dependencies posing to its full potential.

  • Poser Ambassadors

    On your question: "Does it work with JCM's?

    Answer: Yes it does.
    I just cross-checked with KEZ, a figure that has a JCM in her Collar-Breast area, and the same "posing dependencies" work on a figure with JCM's.

    The "return to ZERO" when creating the dependencies is different on KEZ.
    Each figure has "its things". LOL.

  • Poser Ambassadors

    PS, and before there is any misunderstanding…….
    => Never create posing dependencies in the clothing. it does not work.

    Conforming clothing follow the bone bends of the FIGURE ! ! ! and thus the posing dependencies have to be created in the figure.

    Nothing changes for conforming clothing builders.

  • Poser Ambassadors

    Thanks, the texture is not final, this is just a preview .And light is just one sun with HDRI plugged in BG.
    Well as soon I have some time, will go in this deeper. Thanks :) Very much appreciated your answer.

  • @vilters thanks for taking the time and explain how to get more from Poser figures. Not everybody here is a vendor and only interested in knowledge they can use to make money while selling things to inexperienced Poser users.

  • Poser Ambassadors

    @adp Since I am a lazy butt when it comes to weight painting and posing, I am always interested in easy ways. Not only for the market ;)

  • Poser Ambassadors

    None of the inventors of the Dependency Posing System have responded so far, and I do not want to take credit for something I did not invent.*

    Within 6 hrs from now; (More or less midnight here in Belgium), a follow-up video will be uploaded to YouTube, and proper credit will be given to the inventors of the Dependency Posing System.
    The link will be posted here too.

    Best regards, Tony.

  • Poser Ambassadors

    Good example of how to set up dependencies, but this shouldn't be done in the main rotation channels as it prevents other types of poses from being possible. Reserve it for posing dials instead, that way you keep the x y and z rotations free to be posed however they need to be.

  • Poser Ambassadors

    @ambientshade This was what I try to explain also with the "freedom of space" . It is not given here.

  • Poser Ambassadors

    Hint, hint, hint ….. I hr before revealing ! ! !

    So strange. Not a word from the inventors them selves.

    And . . .
    And . . .
    This is so strange. . . Nobody recognizes the system?

    Everybody has it, and has been using it. . . . . on at least 5 different figures, if not at least on 4.

    Well, one more hr to go. LOL.

    Time for a walk with a cigarette, some fresh coffee, and time to make the video.

    See ya in a hr guys.

  • Poser Ambassadors

    Hello guys, here is the link tot the follow-up video on Dependency Controlled Bending in Poser.

    The system was invented in 2014 by the previous Poser team and implemented in the Poser8 figures.

    2 things got the system in the "forget" corner. LOL.

    • At the time of inventing, we still had the old style conventional rigging that had its own limitations.
    • And I think I made the first complete tutorial on how to create those dependencies only yesterday.
      (I remember seeing a small tut floating around in the past, but it was not very detailed and did not go very deep.)

    The original Poser 8 figures were the first, and the system got used very deep into Miki4.

    On Miki 4 , they went a step further.
    There is a hierarchy where one dependency dial controls the next dependency dial that controls the bone movements.
    This is (among others) the case for the Right- and for the Left Arm, and then a dependency control that commands these Right- and Left Arm controls to combine them in a single "Both Arm Up-Down-Twist movement".
    Just open the dependency editor for each and you will automatically see what controls what.

    Conforming clothing.
    Does not care, it just follows.
    Just like an airplane engine does not care if it flies over land or sea, the conforming clothing does not care where the bend, twist or side-side comes from, or who controls what. It just follows the bone bends, twists and side-side of the figures bones.

    Dependency Controlled Bending is there to facilitate Posing.
    Like I show in the video?
    Make Alyson 'or Miki4 go sitting is . . . . . One dial.
    To lift the arms? When all is said and done ? One dial.

    Best regards, and enjoy the video. Tony

  • @vilters
    Wait isn't this a well known fact already ? The video kind of threw me off guard because I myself been doing that since day one (unless im just feeling lazy) but I always thought that was the norm,the way its supposed to be done.(then again I studied how miki posed and moved for a long time maybe thats why I always did it like that))always,Hmmm,even went as far as creating whole poses from just one dial turn..but since you cant see how the pose looks till you dial it in decided not to do that.
    Anyway good explanation and video on this.

  • Poser Ambassadors


    Ha, yes, it was always supposed to be used in this way.

    But you also see some of the reactions here.
    The system was not well known, SM never provided proper tutorials, and I made the video's following multiple discussions in multiple forums.
    But, honestly, I am very happy to see that I am not the only one that digs pretty deep in the technology.

    Best regards, and have fun using the Poser tools.