Should SM organized a Vault-style content?



  • I love my Origin Vault. That's a subscription-based service; you pay $32 per year, and you have access to some 80 games or so. It's so simple!

    The problem, I think, with buying Poser Content (and DAZ Content, for the matter) is that there is a risk in buying it. I bought Victoria 3, Victoria 4, Terai Yuki 2 and several others toons, and I use every single bit of V3 and TY2, but I never really liked my investment in V4 and many other toons; so I get good return in may 10% of my purchases, the rest just sits unused in my library, so I'm not really very keen in buying many more. It's not a matter of the money (I have the spare $ to buy content), but the matter that I'm not really sure if I can use them until I have my hands on them, so whether it's a $5 or a $50 toon, the risk is the same to me.

    Enter a Vault-style content site; pay say $50 per year, and use as many toons as you want, and the content developers get the money based on the number of downloads they get.

    It costs really nothing to set up and maintain, only takes one person to negotiate new content adds, and for the content developer that's a constant source of income. Heck, every time I log in Renderosity I see 3,000 people online, so there must be a market of at least 10,000 potential customers for this, or at least $500k per year to split across developers...



  • I think the restrictions on IP from Daz3D would preclude storage in this manner.



  • I think we should leave DAZ out of the discussion. They are a company with a specific (and very different) business model.
    Question of OP is if such a vault could be a suitable system to facilitate and enhance the flow of money from users to the content creators.
    The model apparently works on games. It also works on museums, public transport systems, gyms. In ' all you can eat' restaurants the model even works on food.
    One common essential thing between all these is a limit in persistence of the deliverables. Consumption is under full control of the system at that place on that moment by that person. The moment you stop the subscription, you can no longer play any of the games, you can no longer access the museum and the bus and gym. The 'all you can eat' restaurant does not provide doggybags to take your leftovers with you. You cannot pay one meal and once you are in get in collect food for the coming week.
    A second thing these systems have in common is that you cannot make derivatives of the deliverables to carry away unless they are in very diluted form like pictures you made. ('Ceci n'est pas une pipe'). The system does not 'leak'.
    There is only one way to stop leakage in digital systems and that is using encrypted proprietary and undisclosed file formats. The files are outside system control but outside the system they are useless.
    For that reason I do not see such 'vaulting' happening for Poser. Communication through open public standards has always been key.



  • For that reason I do not see such 'vaulting' happening for Poser. Communication through open public standards has always been key.

    Hmm... that's a great point... when I was signing for Origin games, I had this doubt: in order to play, I need the subscription, and I'm one that hates subscriptions for anything. I hate hate hate subscriptions as a devil. But it was only $35, so I thought... hmm... thirty bucks per year is no problem, I can keep this forever. Meanwhile anything that is going to cost me $200 per year, oh I'm never ever signing, whatever it provides. So if the service is cheap enough and there's a constant inflow of new products, the subscriptions will be retained.

    Now, it's true that the user may continue to use the product if he cancels the subscription; but the seller gets money when the download happens, so he gets the money in the same way as a sale. In either case the customer will keep the product forever, and depending on the format he can distribute to his friends - that's a weakness of the OBJ file format, not of the sales model.

    So I think the main factor is this: consider 10,000 potential customers, and you have a product to sell. If you can sell to 10,000 people for $30, then you'd never want to get in any shared vault thingie. But say your product will sell to 100 people for $30. That's a fixed $3,000 in the pocket. Now compare that by going to this vault you'll get instead 500 downloads, so which share of the profits will you get for these 500 downloads? That's a variable thing, so it may be more than $3,000 or less than that. May be more, or less, but I suspect this benefits smaller vendors more than large vendors. Large vendors will want to sell directly, of course.

    I think it's the same conundrum that subscription-based eBook sites have. You write a book - will your publisher make more money by selling it directly or by offering through Kindle for subscription customers? Really a fascinating question, indeed.



  • @fbs7
    Hmm you may have seen Biscuits on Patreon exploring a similar offer.


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    @fbs7 said in Should SM organized a Vault-style content?:

    For that reason I do not see such 'vaulting' happening for Poser. Communication through open public standards has always been key.

    Hmm... that's a great point... when I was signing for Origin games, I had this doubt: in order to play, I need the subscription, and I'm one that hates subscriptions for anything. I hate hate hate subscriptions as a devil. But it was only $35, so I thought... hmm... thirty bucks per year is no problem, I can keep this forever. Meanwhile anything that is going to cost me $200 per year, oh I'm never ever signing, whatever it provides. So if the service is cheap enough and there's a constant inflow of new products, the subscriptions will be retained.

    Yes, one could see Patreon as a vault subscription, pay what you like minimum is $1 per month.

    I agree I dislike subscriptions with a passion.....however I cannot get a perpetual license for Photoshop so I must use the subscription.

    The advantage for Patreon, you can cancel subscriptions anytime and it gives creators more freedom.

    And the more goodies Creators create, the more the vault will be filled.



  • It's a good idea, but the problem is still how much content would actually be available for such a project? We still come back to the old problem that the majority of content creators make their stuff for D|S, it comes down to how many contributors of products to the vault, how many paying members of the vault, what content do Poser users buy and will the vendors make enough to warrant their time and effort put into creation of said products.
    I hate to sound so negative, but one has to be realistic, just as a quick example - how many of you were members of the Platinum Club?



  • @tastiger said in Should SM organized a Vault-style content?:

    I hate to sound so negative, but one has to be realistic, just as a quick example - how many of you were members of the Platinum Club?

    You mean DAZ Platinum Club? That was useless to me... it would give one freebie per week (gah) and a discount on items I'd have to pay for anyway. Meanwhile I'm the one that bought quite a bit of stuff that he doesn't use, so my problem with buying stuff, even for $5, is not for the $5 but with the guilty feeling of spending money on childish impulses for stuff I don't know if I'll use. So after a couple of years of buying spree I really stopped.

    But it's true what you said. I think that Renderosity, rather than SM, would be the best one to organize one such thing, as they work with Poser, Blender, DAZ, iClone, etc...

    Renderosity would become Paradisity if they could get a subscription of say $10/month, and then you download whatever you want (from a selection). What's the market for that? Say, how many people go from time to time to Renderosity to browse and download stuff? Like, 10,000 people? 30,000?