PC spec priorities for Poser



  • @rsk

    In modern versions of Poser (and just about every other piece of software), cores are more important than single core operating frequency. It isn't 1991 anymore. The Ryzen is faster, with more cores and cache, at the same power draw.

    The other thing to keep in mind is that the AM4 socket set will be supported through at least the next generation of Ryzen, so moving from 2nd gen to 3rd gen is a simple drop in (and probably a bios update). Intel will move to a new socket (because of an upcoming die shrink - And this time Intel really, really means it!, requiring a motherboard replacement.



  • I must respectfully disagree with ssgbryan over this to some extent. While cores are more important for rendering, for almost everything else in poser single core performance is more relevant. Just look at resource monitor while simple moving the camera around the screen. You will find a single thread running at 100% while the remainder are idle. No it's not 1991, but a lot of poser code seems to be from about this period, and only runs single threaded. So for general responsiveness single thread performance is important.



  • I use a Ryzen7. The single thread Performance is a bit lower than the I7-7700 (Intel about 13% faster), but when Rendering the Ryzen is about 75% faster. I don't have any problems when posing, IMHO the single core speed is not that important.



  • @rsk

    As above guys suggested or recommended I would go with Ryzen, I would wait as AMD preparing release of 3xxx series and with 3xxx there should be 16 core/32 thread Ryzen, if not then 12 core/24 threads

    AM4 will be supported until Zen2 and X570 series of motherboard should bring us PCI_E 4th generation etc

    If you do render then I wouldn't think on Intel CPU unless you are prepared to spend money, Intel chips usually cost more and performance in rendering depending on SW and mainly on developers and Microsoft itself

    16GB RAM should be minimum, 32GB I would recommend

    @h-elwood-gilliland

    Not sure but I have built few Ryzen based PC which are mainly rendering workstations, for money you are hardly find better chips, Microsoft still didn't fixed Core scheduler for their ThreadRipper

    Buying prebuilt PC I wouldn't do, you can built own PC for lot less, yours posted HP Omen PC are using non K models, spec is meh, for same amount of OP should be built better PC, you can check render speeds of these CPU like is 7700 or 7100 etc

    Hope this helps

    Thanks, Jura



  • @jura11 Thank you for your reply...

    ...and thanks to everyone else who has taken time to give advice about this subject. I must admit that a few things went flying over my head so fast I didn't notice them. :)

    For me, budget is the main driver so although I realise things like 32Gb RAM is recommended, I simply can't afford it!

    I've found some affordable machines though with the Ryzen processor mentioned throughout this thread + a GPU which is way better than the one I have now and 16Gb RAM, lots of HDD + some SSD which is nice to have - all coming in under the £1K mark.

    Anyway, lots for me to ponder, but loads of new info from all of you to help me.

    Thanks again,
    RSK.



  • Glad we could help. And remember, you can always add ram later.



  • @ssgbryan said in PC spec priorities for Poser:

    Glad we could help. And remember, you can always add ram later.

    As long as you don't fill all the slots, i.e get 2x8Gb modules rather than 4x4Gb to get 16Gb that way you can add extra without having to throw away what you already have.


  • Poser Team

    Why argue? What is valuable to you:
    https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Intel-Core-i9-9900K-vs-AMD-Ryzen-7-2700X/4028vs3958
    (Ignore the "user rating")

    Intel scores "superior" in all categories except price. Not much different from the last AMD processor. Power users could do more for all applications.



  • @h-elwood-gilliland said in PC spec priorities for Poser:

    Why argue? What is valuable to you:
    https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Intel-Core-i9-9900K-vs-AMD-Ryzen-7-2700X/4028vs3958
    (Ignore the "user rating")

    Intel scores "superior" in all categories except price. Not much different from the last AMD processor. Power users could do more for all applications.

    CPU userbenchmark is bit misleading website

    Off course 9900k is better CPU, it can be OC to 5.0GHz and 5.2GHz easily, have built one PC with that CPU and our best OC has been 5.2GHz, but it cost twice as 2700X

    2700 from AMD is too well worth it if budget is lower and you are not looking to OC

    I would have suggest check these benchmarks

    https://www.cgdirector.com/cinebench-scores-updated/

    https://corona-renderer.com/benchmark/results/cpu/9900k

    https://corona-renderer.com/benchmark/results/cpu/2700x

    Hope this helps

    Thanks, Jura



  • @amethystpendant That's a good call - thanks for the reminder. Of course I know about this but I always forget when I'm buying the PC! :)


  • Poser Team

    I wouldn't worry too much about 32GB versus 16GB. 64GB is just way out of the box anyway.



  • @h-elwood-gilliland 64GB RAM?? Man alive! I still remember upgrading my Atari 800 from 16K to 48K. Happy times.
    Anyway, FYI, I'm going with 32K RAM - they added it at a good price and only blew my budget a bit...



  • From the £ signs I assume you're in the UK; have a think about a refurbished workstation, https://www.bargainhardware.co.uk/dell-precision-t7610-twr-configure-to-order. The configuration options will be limited by what they have in stock, but if you're careful you can put together a real beast of a thing on the sort of budget you mentioned.


  • Poser Ambassadors

    You need processor cores and enough RAM so that you'll never approach that limit.

    Be mindful that your usage habits may become more ambitious as you gain experience, so that you use more memory a few years from now.
    I have exceeded 64GB total system memory in use while rendering in Poser, albeit with a massive scene using complex materials and tight render settings, at large pixel dimensions. TinkerBell has 96GB RAM, so not a problem.

    I second the advice by @MrPunch and will add that you should look specifically for a used workstation with dual CPUs. These will have sockets for two processors on the motherboard. It's a great way to instantly double the total number of rendering cores. As far as I know, only Xeon processors can run in parallel.
    0_1549736923587_SUPERMICRO MBD-X8DTL-i-O Dual 1366 ATX sized mobo 200%.jpg

    The (used) X5675 Xeons in my workstation Urania cost $32 (US) each; they are HyperThreaded hex core, factory clocked at 3.06GHz (w/ 3.46GHz turbo). So, for $64 I have twenty four render threads clocked at 3.06GHz.
    The X5675 is one of several Westmere series Xeon processors which are H/T hex core and use the 1366 socket:
    0_1549737277423_Westmere clockspeeds.PNG

    If you buy a used workstation, I would replace any hard drives with new ones. An Acronis license will let you make a compressed backup of the existing hard drive (including the Windows installation) and mirror it to the new hard drive.

    If you need a Windows license, shop for an OEM license (not the retail version in a jewel box).

    Be wary of used video cards; it may have been run to near death by a Bitcoin miner.


  • Poser Ambassadors

    TinkerBell is a T7500 chassis; Tink has dual X5690 Xeon processors (24 threads at 3.46GHz), 96GB RAM, and a 12GB nVidia Titan Z video card.
    0_1549740495965_TinkerBell T7500 - rendering.jpg



  • @seachnasaigh

    Dual CPU Xeon LGA1366 are not worth the money,yes off course they're 12 core/24 thread but these CPU scores in Cinebench less than Ryzen 2700/2700X or X99 5960X these CPU scores in Cinebench easy 1700CB points,in other render engines these CPU are still better than any dual Xeon LGA1366,8700k scores with 5.2GHz somewhere around 1600-1700CB and this CPU is 6 core/12 thread

    2700/2700X I would choose without the question as this CPU can be bought for £249 for 2700 and £280-£300 for 2700X

    This is my,its 5960X which now can be bought for £300,MB for around £100-£150 and RAM this depends,I'm running 96GB still can be upgraded to 128GB,on this picture I'm still running only 3GPUs,now I'm running 4GPUs and different motherboard ASRock X99 WS

    alt text

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    Hope this helps

    Thanks,Jura


  • Poser Ambassadors

    @jura11 said in PC spec priorities for Poser:

    @seachnasaigh

    Dual CPU Xeon LGA1366 are not worth the money

    This is a bit misleading.
    Yes the Ryzen 2700 is faster in some tests at stock speeds. Against a single Xeon Cpu...

    A bone stock Dual X5690 system is no slouch.
    Just about 1500 in cinebench.
    The Ryzen 2700, about 1525 or so.
    Basically no difference.
    Ryzen 2700x about 1700...
    If you air cooled overclock a dual X5690 system, the Ryzen 2700x suddenly isn't faster, at anything.
    Water cool it, well, do the math on that....

    You can sometimes find used dual X5690 servers on ebay for less than the price of a Ryzen 2700x cpu.
    How is that not a value if a complete server, is cheaper than a 2700x cpu?


  • Poser Ambassadors

    Here is a perfect example of what I am talking about price wise.

    Well equipped Dual X5690 server



  • @shvrdavid don't those servers need a second computer for admin because they don't have a video card? Just curious.



  • @shvrdavid said in PC spec priorities for Poser:

    @jura11 said in PC spec priorities for Poser:

    @seachnasaigh

    Dual CPU Xeon LGA1366 are not worth the money

    This is a bit misleading.
    Yes the Ryzen 2700 is faster in some tests at stock speeds. Against a single Xeon Cpu...

    A bone stock Dual X5690 system is no slouch.
    Just about 1500 in cinebench.
    The Ryzen 2700, about 1525 or so.
    Basically no difference.
    Ryzen 2700x about 1700...
    If you air cooled overclock a dual X5690 system, the Ryzen 2700x suddenly isn't faster, at anything.
    Water cool it, well, do the math on that....

    You can sometimes find used dual X5690 servers on ebay for less than the price of a Ryzen 2700x cpu.
    How is that not a value if a complete server, is cheaper than a 2700x cpu?

    2700X scores around 1800CB and with OC 1900-1950CB easy, 2700 is better if you want OC I have built few PCs with 2700 or 2700X and both OC pretty much same around 4.3GHz(only on one build we are seen 4.4GHz), 2 of them are cooled by air cooler Thermalright Le Grand Macho RT and NH-D15S and other 2 are running under water

    Regarding the water cooling and air cooling, have run my 5960x or 5820k or 5930k with NH-D15 and been happy with temperatures, with all my chips I could OC my CPU up to 4.6Ghz, water cooling I do only on request, usually for single CPU and GPU good air cooler like NH-D15 or Thermalright Le Grand Macho RT is more than enough,I would stay clear of any AIO or CLC from Corsair or any cooler where is used Asetek pump

    Yes I agree you can find used X5690 servers like you posted for good money but who have at home sever rack, PSU etc I don't and many people don't have same

    I still try to keep clear from any dual CPU system, been burned by Asus Z10PE-D8 and D16 and X58 EVGA SR-2

    Hope this helps

    Thanks, Jura